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  • #41

    I would agree that nimble anime mecha might be a pain to operate, build and maintain when you have limited budget. Sturdy constructions that are easy to maintain and repair, and you know how to make parts for them, would probably dominate that sandy landscape. With more outlandish designs being either something that you find in some werehouse and either use untill it brakes or scrap for parts... but it would be a rare sight most likely. As for the support craft in the "fleet" well, I think that again, resources and manpower would be a limiting factor. Less resources and manpower to... erm... support a support fleet, equals smaller fleets.

    A few words about fusion. Fusion not only gives us power but gives us acces to some intresting technology that would make life a bit easier for those roving-city dwellers. You can make a "fusion furnace" that would disperse basically anything you throw inside into it's constituing atoms, and it would ionise them, so you could funnel this product using electromagnets and sort them according to atomic mass using mass spectrometers... when you have fusion power at hand, making such a thing should be easy. Then you can use those materials in fabrication. So any trash, or equipment broken beyond repair could go back into the pot to make spare parts and assorted stuff out of it. It makes supply chains a bit easier to manage.

    The other thing about fusion power is that reactors do not blow up (sorry, unless you want to invoke the rule of cool) anything that compromises your reactor throws the fusion reaction out of whack and the reaction dies, and you need to supply it with power to start it again (preferably repairing your reactor first). Even if the thing that compromises your reactor is a bullet, then what most likely could happen, is that some plasma could slip out of the reaction chamber (prior to the reacton going bye bye), along with parts of your radiation shielding ripped off and/or vaporised by the projectile (and that is radioactive so it might be a slight problem). That could endanger the immidiate area, like the reactor room. Start some fires possibly, fudge with some unprotected electronics, vaporise few people and equipment that got too close. But a fusion reactor is not a fusion bomb. Totally different thing. Basically safe.

    (Even runaway fission reaction is not that bad... relatively speaking. I mean you will probably have a superheated steam explosion that could scatter radioactive material from the fuel... and the reactor core might melt down, and turn into a slush of radioactive "lava" that will burn through the bottom of your reactor and beyond, untill it reaches something it cannot burn through. Sooo... fun times there, but it is still not the "super fun mushroom cloud of doom" that most people imagine. Now that I think about it. Potentially more destructive then borking a fusion reactor... maybe, possibly.)
    Terrapun's Signature
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    • #42

      Weeeeell lets say for now that the way the ship is powered is unknown to me but it works... Fuel would be more coolant for the planes and such.
      Whilst I thinkt here should be forges on this ship it wouldn't go down to the molecular disassembling kind. It would be the more forge and hammer kind. Though of course properly tech wise so large-ish smelters, automated tools, cutters, rollers and so on. Not apron and an anvil.
      So there is recycling, and very good at that, but not as neat as you described Terra.

      And yeah, I should have remembered that about the reactors not asplodin' but I sorta generally meant that if it got hit by one of the rail cannon rounds or something it would pretty much mean the end of the ship moving and it would irradiate so much that it'd have to be abandoned. But it is therefore probably the most armored thing in the ship. Probably has liquid in the walls too like a reactor pool to stop any radiation from getting out and then back up things for if there IS a hole it would be able to be sealed. Restarting the reactor would be a bish... Come on, everyone on their pedal bikes! We can do it!

      So you guys helped me go from 'rule of cool' anime with mechs to a much more slow and gritty science fiction about survival on a doomed world.

      Now a lil thing about how I wanna run this. I wanna use scenes. That is probably not the correct name for this but basically it means that there will be time stamps... or scenes.

      For example, each scene starts with the narrator setting up things for everyone and then the 'scene' (events) gets set in motion. The narrator will then shut his gob as every PC plays out parts of their story until the event is resolved or has to be halted by reality (sleep) and such.
      I will, in PM or a chat or so on or on a side forum give each person a choice of things they can investigate, do or react to at the start of the scene but everything after that is free form.

      For instance, whoever is in the scout plane would get a simple thing saying 'You see a train bridge thataway (i'd be more technical), a wreck of a cruise liner ship over there and in the distance you swear you can see a glint of metal.' at which point they can decide what to do and where to go. Once they are near their thing I will say what they encounter which might mean shorter posts at times as you react to things, and not the novels you guys post... , but I feel it'll... give direction to the non Gm players to create their own stories on the ring world.

      I could just keep the narrator in instead of PMs and make it all descriptive... I think that might be nice too but you'd have to excuse some lapses in posting as I try to write it neatly. Course if anything is confusing, feel free to PM me.

      I will also, before we start, have a role call!
      As in, who wants to be what station!

      The Admiral is taken but that doesn't mean he will be the only one deciding the course of the ship, he will just have final call.
      The Admiral's Aide is also taken as she is just the lady who helps the aging Admiral with small tasks.

      So we need an XO, Chief of engineering, Commanders of the tanks and ground troops, Scouts, hot shot pilots and so on!
      Medical of course... Gunners... I doubt you wanna be one of the bridge crew since they just stare at screens and do what the Admiral or XO tells them to.
      People will pull double duty at times. A pilot knows how to fix their plane if it stalls in the desert, same with tank crew and such. The engineering crew also draws up technical plans... You know, lil loosely played rules. It is the apocalypse.

      Um. Any suggestions?
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      • #43

        Originally posted by Miqu View Post
        Maybe I should draw the city with an airstrip.
        I'd like to see that! I think it would be interesting seeing what different cities prioritise, so some might have a landing strip where others might slap on extra turrets or have ramshackle slums growing out, where the very poorest live beyond the protection from sandstorms.

        Originally posted by Rick Canaan View Post
        These kinds of machines are extremely complex and sophisticated. They'd need whole support crews with specialized training and machine shops able to manufacture extremely intricate parts. If a society was able to support that level of sophistication, then it wouldn't be post-apocalyptic. It would be a civilized society.
        *Approaches podium. Clears throat*

        Technically speaking, while the likes of Mad Max have forever shaped the way people view the concept of a post-apoc society, there's nothing inherent in the concept of living in a post-apocalyptic world that suggests technology is no longer advanced or effective. It is definitely relevant - where the apocalypse came via a violent war or catastrophe and humanity survived by retreating to shelters for at least a generation - to suggest that knowledge of operating such machines may be lost. However, in this instance the apocalypse is technically still ongoing, and is a drawn-out shift in climate rather than a singular event. This means there has been no sudden loss of generation which understands the machine, and the knowledge can easily survive. Yes, it's true that such knowledge typically comes from well-maintained and organised centres of learning, such as universities or apprenticeships, so the knowledge is very unlikely to thrive in the post-apoc environment, but it's quite plausible to presume that working knowledge could be passed down through small groups. In fact, in a world where operating such machines was the difference between life and death, I find it reasonable to suggest that operating fusion-powered city-crawlers and low-atmo jets might be a reasonably common skill-set, whereas concepts such as reading or farming might be the reserve of the few intellectuals with enough free time to waste. You could feasibly have a nuclear engineer who doesn't know what an apple is.

        That being said, I agree that the intricate parts would be an issue. Such machines would likely be patchworked with repairs, 80% duct tape and 10% kicking it until it works. One city might attack another because it has run out of a certain type of screw and its reactor is close to falling apart. Probably a lot of leaks and cracks, making it dangerous work to keep them running. But quite possible. If you look at Cold War nuclear reactors and weaponry, they're usually still functional, even if it's not advisable to do so.

        Also, in this setting, I believe there's the concept of underground cities which have mostly been protected from the ravages of the dying surface? Spare parts or in-tact machinery could be abundant down there.

        Originally posted by Miqu View Post
        I will also, before we start, have a role call! As in, who wants to be what station! [...] So we need an XO, Chief of engineering, Commanders of the tanks and ground troops, Scouts, hot shot pilots and so on!
        Medical of course... Gunners... I doubt you wanna be one of the bridge crew since they just stare at screens and do what the Admiral or XO tells them to.
        People will pull double duty at times. A pilot knows how to fix their plane if it stalls in the desert, same with tank crew and such. The engineering crew also draws up technical plans... You know, lil loosely played rules. It is the apocalypse. [...] Um. Any suggestions?
        Oh, by the time I got ready to post this reply, the option to start discussing characters was up! Welp! I'll have a think, and hopefully get back to you with a position tomorrow.

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        • #44

          Well you can still discuss characters. I do not have a start set in stone though the first narration post is ready!
          Also, good memory! I only mentioned the underground bunkers (so not cities but close!) once! They are big... eh... 'stairwells' or elevator shafts that go to the outside of the ring and launched the ships of the rich into space. You can't 'drop' something into space from a planet but from a ring you... sorta can?
          There's still gravity of course cause a ring that size has mass and mass generates gravity... But I still feel it'd be easier to launch away from the ring than to launch to the middle and then go out.

          But yes, those bunkers, if you can get them open, must have stuff in them! If not food, probably advanced electronics used for the rocket launches.

          And yeah, I'll wait to start the RP until everyone seems comfy with their chosen characters.

          One thing about the characters that may help! If they are older than twenty, sort of near their thirties, they might remember their childhood during the resource wars before the Belenos (that's the ship's name, it is a sun god) was turned into the city ship. So you might be a grizzled war vet! If you are younger you are born on the ship!

          Yes, this means the ship has been underway and doing its thing for about 25 years. That might seem short for an apocalypse but imagine a boat having to work for 25 years with no dry dock and no new parts... This way we can also have young people who know nothing of life before the ship, older vets or war born childeren and the very old who remember the start of the wars and may have even seen *gasp* an ocean!

          Also at some point I am going to have to put... eh... my foot down and just accept any more odd mistakes I make in the RP world or this will never get started... You can point em out tho or give helpful critisism for my next posts but if, say, a plane type we used would not actually work... handwave it unless it would really REALLY not work.

          Speaking of the planes. Through some research I have found out that turboprop planes are the modern version of war planes and they function pretty much the same and have a top speed of generally 300 miles an hour. Any faster and you kinda want a Jet engine. If you'd be working with combustion fuel anyvays.
          So, our planes will also have that 300 Mph limit but not use the combustion turbine to speed up the propeller, instead just having more advanced electrical engines and a whole bucketload of dust filters.

          So if yer gonna be a pilot. Take your favorite war plane and imagine it more high techy! No missiles! Dumb fire rockets are very effective and easier to make and cheaper! ... !

          Ok I'ma go sleep now. Or try.
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          • #45

            HOKAY! So, I have decided to CHANGE the RP I was working on into something that just frankly makes a whole lot more sense. Sorry about that. I will just write out quickly what has and hasn't changed...

            In a universe where FTL is impossible a species sent out a group long long ago to make a bank orbital to colonize later and this happened successfully. Around a K type star there is now an orbital all pretty and nice.
            But then contact with the Orbital became erratic. Messages of things going wrong started reaching the home planet and soon coms went dark...
            A very large sleeper pod equipped ship, filled with talented men and women who volunteered, is launched to the Orbital with a no return mission in mind. Find out what happened and fix the broken coms so the Orbital can function again. In this ship sits the most advanced Mobile Base ever. The Belenos.

            Upon arrival, as everyone awakens, they find the Orbital to be arid instead of lush and utopian. They land their mobile base because their ship is not designed to return and receive nothing but static when trying to contact any city or government. Something has gone terribly wrong.
            The Belenos sets up a coms center and sends a distress signal back to the home world, asking for rescue. After a few weeks they receive the answer that help will be sent. An automated pickup ship to pickup the crew of the Belenos and any survivors that the Belenos has found upon the surface. But... without FTL it means that this rescue will have to travel nearly a decade before it can arrive to pick up everyone... So now the Belenos must survive.

            The new mission;
            Go to places of population to find spare parts, new vehicles and survivors to keep the Belenos and its water filtration system, radar system and locating beacons working long enough for the rescue.
            Failure means the crew of the Belenos will die of thirst and heat as the ship stops functioning.

            As for tech? Homeworld deserts of whatchamacallit for the land vehicles. As for planes? I think electric prop planes would still work. Small, easy to fix, slightly lower speed, no need to carry massive amounts of fuel on the sleeper pod ship to have them functioning.
            I don't think there are electrical jet engine planes? So prop planes work.

            The city and civilians are gone but of course once survivors get picked up they need a place to stay.

            What this means is that the vehicles the Belenos comes with are higher tech than those on the ring. There may or may not still be survivors and attackers.
            The Belenos will use treads instead of augers cause it makes way more sense... Also this way the ring world is and isn't alien. Like how to civs in the same Era might have different tech but not in such a way that you wouldn't understand it. Wadda ya think?
            Last edited by Miqu; 09-02-2017, 06:08 PM. Reason: All the info!
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            • #46

              Ooh, that's quite a change! An interesting one though! What prompted it?

              And while both settings definitely have their charm, I think the lush but unnervingly lifeless (from the colonisation point of view at least) environment makes for a more unique setting. Sounds like there may be a bit of a mystery behind what has caused this radio silence.

              I rather like the idea of being someone who would have been incredibly useful if the mission was going as planned, but in the situation they find themselves stuck is way out of their depth. Something like a large-scale industrial engineer, someone who understands the construction of the ring they're on or can design entire colonisation settlements, but has no idea what to do out in an alien jungle for a decade :p

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              • #47

                Mostly I changed it for ease of GMing it and playing it. Keeping the mobile base mobile out of necessity this way makes more sense than the scavenging to trade with a shady government. Also this way you can have archaeology and sciences go on along side the need for pure survival until the rescue. If it is even coming!

                And whilst they are colonist, their main job was to respond to what seemed to be major equipment failure that caused a radio silence. The last messages they received also made people thing that a revolution or war might be at hand so the mobile base does come with defensive units, just not a lot of them...

                Dunnu if I should start the RP with planetfall, meaning you all just woke up from the cryo sleep and get to be in space a bit first, or after the distress signal has been sent back home requesting pickup from the dead world and the search for parts, food and survivors has started.
                I think the being in space a bit will be interesting if I don't accidentally let it drag too long.

                But my question is, how many people will actually join? I am pretty much set this time cause it is a lil easier.
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                • #48

                  I think electric prop planes would work famously. On Earth, they might be unfeasible, gravity being what it is, would require very frequent recharging. But on a place like this, where light from the star is abundant, recharging wouldn't be an issue. Add to that the low gravity, and the planes wouldn't need to have very high-powered motors, either.

                  But I think what might be an even better idea, would be four-propeller drone configurations. They'd be light, fast, and highly maneuverable. And you could have it piloted by a man, or have it flown by remote, or both. I think by then, too, if they have the technology to build this orbiter, then their photo-voltiac panel technology would be quite advanced, as well. Put a battery pack on the drone and an array of photo-voltiac panels on its upper surface, and you'd have an aerial vehicle that would have virtually unlimited range.

                  Or as an alternative, you could have something like this:

                  Click image for larger version

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                  That's the 'Velocipod' from The Incredibles. It might be a little harder to put sufficient photo-voltiac panels on something like this, to give it endless charge capability, but who's to say you couldn't power it with a small fusion bottle? But in the movie, they were very fast, and as maneuverable as helicopters.

                  Just tossing some ideas out there, as the idea of a fixed-wing aircraft, after thinking it over some, seemed a little impractical.
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                  • #49

                    I do not want to go too advanced. It had been recommended to me to go down the prop plane route for ease of rebuilding them and I agree that in a post apocalyptic world a simple propellor and fixed wing aircraft is going to be much easier to maintain than any sort of high maintenance, lots of lil very advanced parts Vtol.

                    Also, the crawler has its own generator but does not come with solar panels from the start, at least not enough to power the entire crawler. Those will have to be scavenged. What kind of generator? I don't know... I really do not. I am not schooled in science. I just know that the crawler is too small for it to be able to do molecular unbinding and that if it stops and can't be restarted the crawler is dead in the sand. So perhaps solar panels would be a good suggestion to find first once ring side. Planet side? Once yer on the ground.

                    This ring was built without force fields and by a species that does not have FTL because in this setting FTL is not possible. Powering one propeller with solar panels on an aircraft also seems easier than 4 and a gryo and computer needed to keep it all upright.

                    So, tanks, ATV Scout, Jeep, Aircraft. All rather simple and electrical.

                    And yes, without FTL and force fields it would mean this ring took maybe the better part of a century to make. Also makes it believable that they might have fucked it up during construction and only noticed too late.
                    How does the ring keep its atmosphere and such? I don't know! And in the long term of the story it doesn't matter as much. It is a mystery why the ring failed.
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                    • #50

                      Alright - sounds good by me. I was just popping suggestions out there, based upon Slice's arguments. But in the world you seem to be formulating here, a fixed-wing aircraft does make more sense.

                      Either way, I am starting to develop an interest in this. That is assuming you're planning to GM it, of course. Or maybe Slice or someone else. I would like to join something like this as a player, but as I said previously, I've never had enough interest in post-apocalyptic to have been able to accumulate any real knowledge about it.

                      That being said, I have a character in mind. I do have a question about it, though: what kinds of characters can you play? I am assuming an assortment of anthro species, right? Kind of the norm, since we're an anthro site. If a variety of anthro is indeed the case, then I know precisely what I would like to play. If you can get a character sheet setup, I'll get about filling one out!

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                      • #51

                        Originally posted by Rick Canaan View Post
                        If you can get a character sheet setup, I'll get about filling one out!
                        Did someone say "character sheet"?! KABOOM: Sample Character Profiles - SciFiFur.net Community Forums !

                        I hoped those might actually come in handy some day. I wonder if they're easy enough to find, though...

                        And if you're up for RPing it, Miqu, and you want to find out exact player numbers before starting, I'd recommend you start a topic here: Roleplay Proposals - SciFiFur.net Community Forums (which is actually the subforum that THIS thread is in! But a new topic would be recommended, since it'll be easier to grab new people's attention rather than a rather chunky thread like this one has become)

                        Originally posted by Miqu View Post
                        Dunnu if I should start the RP with planetfall, meaning you all just woke up from the cryo sleep and get to be in space a bit first, or after the distress signal has been sent back home requesting pickup from the dead world and the search for parts, food and survivors has started.
                        I think the being in space a bit will be interesting if I don't accidentally let it drag too long.
                        It entirely depends on what you'd like to focus on as the GM, but since we're all stuck together and aren't going home any time soon, I'd guess that interpersonal relationships are important here? As in, having us all band together and rely on one another to survive. So having us interact on the ship after waking up but before disaster would help us get to grips with one another's characters and start forming in-universe bonds.

                        Originally posted by Rick Canaan View Post
                        what kinds of characters can you play? I am assuming an assortment of anthro species, right?
                        I'm also curious about this! Although complete choice of species is more open, please feel free to limit them if that would suit your own purposes. Given that we're all coming from one civilisation and it's pre-FTL, it might make sense to have a smaller number of species. One would be most realistic, but perhaps a tad limiting. I'd say it's plausible for about three or four sentient species to develop side-by-side and eventually form a single planet-bound civilisation. Those base species could then branch off into variants in the same way as humanity has our various races and dogs have various breeds. So you might stipulate that players can only be "canine, equine or avian" (choices of course inspired by our beloved staff here on SciFiFur). Or design an alien race for us to use! I rather like playing races that aren't any identifiable anthro species.

                        Anyway, I'm rambling. It's up to you, is what I'm getting at XD

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                        • #52

                          I think we shall indeed start with the bit in space before planet fall so everyone can be at zero G a bit and get talking with each other. Yes, the cocoon ship holding the Belenos does not have artificial gravity! It'll be made clear what it is in the first post I'll make.

                          As for species... Any mammalian species is ok and so are birds but remember that it is going to be Hot! With a capital H! The larger you are, the warmer you will be and the harder to cool down.
                          Lizards and other reptiles will be able to survive with more ease.

                          Whatever you play will be limited to medium sized (so human sized) and must have your standard number of limbs and functional hands and feet. In fact. We are all going to be more human than animal meaning plantigrade feet, long fingers and thumb and, depending ont he species, shorter snouts.
                          So you'd be feline, canine, vulpine and so on but not to the point of digidigrade legs or biiiig snarling maws. Same deal for any lizards! So no Nagas! Like Slice said, this species all comes from one planet so it makes sense to basically have one overarching species with the biggest difference being between the furries and the scalies.

                          Humans of course vary a whole lot so you can diversify that way. Ears, nose, eyes, eyebrows, height, width. Just remember you are an astronaut and thus have been training for space missions and in this more advanced society that might mean a lil more lax rules on who gets to fly but if you are too large to fit in a cryopod... yeh...

                          And I will... start getting the forum post ready to actually give all of this a try and write down an FAQ and so. Just excuse me if it takes a lil bit.
                          Also thanks for those Character templates!
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